Banjo Kazooie!

[Angelic Lapras King]

First gameplay vid.

http://www.n4g.com/gaming/News-144989.aspx

How the heck did they get away with that image of Mario? o.o

[Spore]

Rare butchering another franchise. By the way, this game is already on Steam for 10 dollars. It is called Garry's Mod, folks.

[theUndead_feature]

Huh. I don't know what to make of it. I'll have to wait until more comes out about the game before I decide if it's crap or not.

[SegaFan]

It looks like they've gone for "different" instead of "bigger and better" by introducing vehicles. One of the most impressive parts of the N64 series was the scale, the levels were big and very detailed by N64 standards. If they were going for similar gameplay to the originals, the levels would have to be absolutely huge now to have the same impact. By making it different they've avoided having to make it better than the originals (which would be extremely difficult). It could still be good, it's too early to tell.

[Spore]

Originally Posted by SegaFan

It looks like they've gone for "different" instead of "bigger and better" by introducing vehicles. One of the most impressive parts of the N64 series was the scale, the levels were big and very detailed by N64 standards. If they were going for similar gameplay to the originals, the levels would have to be absolutely huge now to have the same impact. By making it different they've avoided having to make it better than the originals (which would be extremely difficult). It could still be good, it's too early to tell.

Rare did state that the Showdown Town, the area where the game takes place, is 16 times larger than anything they have ever made so far.

[Mickeymac]

I can't remember much about it, but it must not have been that fun, since I only rented it once( if it's good, I usually rent it over and over). Thankfully we have demos now, so I'll try before I buy, and see what I think.

Edit: Oh wait, Nuts 'n' Bolts! Yeah, that looks awesome! I've always wished they'd make a game like that, I can't wait!

[Mickeymac]

Okay, I played Banjo Kazooie and Nuts 'n' Bolts, and they both sucked.

[Spore]

Originally Posted by Mickeymac

Okay, I played Banjo Kazooie and Nuts 'n' Bolts, and they both sucked.

Your opinion doesn't matter because you hate everything, remember? Pretty good bump too.

[Shortay]

Originally Posted by Mickeymac

Okay, I played Banjo Kazooie and Nuts 'n' Bolts, and they both sucked.

I was really disappointed with Nuts & Bolts but what didn't you like about the original Banjo Kazooie? It's one of the best 3D platformers in my opinion, and I still love it till this day.

[Mickeymac]

Originally Posted by Shortay

I was really disappointed with Nuts & Bolts but what didn't you like about the original Banjo Kazooie? It's one of the best 3D platformers in my opinion, and I still love it till this day.

I didn't like that I basically couldn't go five steps in any direction without collection some random do-hickey that does who-knows-what-and-why-should-I-care. I mean, I like collecting things in games, but in Banjo Kazooie it's simply excessive, and it became rather tiresome. Plus, since collecting everything was essentially the main objective, whenever I came to a particularly annoying part, I couldn't get myself to just leave it, since I knew I'd have to come back for it eventually, thus leading to massive amounts of frustration.

As for Nuts 'n' Bolts, well...actually, I really should give that game another chance. Last time I played it, I simply spent most of my time collecting random objects and running over bespectacled pedestrians with my giant red wagon...which actually was pretty fun, like Grand Theft Auto for kids.


And shut up spore, it that joke got old weeks ago, and now you're seriously ****ing me off!

[SKTTR]

The N64 had so few games, it was actually a good thing to have some games with lots of collectibles.
Who would have a want a short game with no replay value per month?
No-one! The more stuff to do the better!
I loved to find every last collectible in games such as Banjo.

It was challenging, yeah, frustrating, no.
It's a Rare game so you should know what to expect.

Now with games flooding the market, I can see many people have too much games to cope with and no time.
More and more short games for quick fun is where the trend's going.

All I wanna say is, two decades ago, your opinion was worth a dogs bone.

[Mickeymac]

Originally Posted by SKTTR

The N64 had so few games, it was actually a good thing to have some games with lots of collectibles.
Who would have a want a short game with no replay value per month?
No-one! The more stuff to do the better!
I loved to find every last collectible in games such as Banjo.

It was challenging, yeah, frustrating, no.
It's a Rare game so you should know what to expect.

Now with games flooding the market, I can see many people have too much games to cope with and no time.
More and more short games for quick fun is where the trend's going.

All I wanna say is, one decade ago, your opinion was worth a dogs bone.

*fixed*

And I probably wouldn't have liked that game back then, either. I just don't like collecting lots of random do-Hickeys. I hated it in Donkey Kong 64, I hated it in Banjo-Tooie, and now I hate it in Banjo-Kazooie. Plus, back then I considered replay value to be whether or not I would continue playing it. With BK, I found the main gameplay to be annoying, and nothing else about the game really sucked me in. I wouldn't have much of a reason to keep on playing it when I already had better games.

[SKTTR]

Originally Posted by Mickeymac

*fixed*

And I probably wouldn't have liked that game back then, either. I just don't like collecting lots of random do-Hickeys. I hated it in Donkey Kong 64, I hated it in Banjo-Tooie, and now I hate it in Banjo-Kazooie. Plus, back then I considered replay value to be whether or not I would continue playing it. With BK, I found the main gameplay to be annoying, and nothing else about the game really sucked me in. I wouldn't have much of a reason to keep on playing it when I already had better games.

How come?

In June 1998, when BK was released, there were only two great 3D-Jump&Run's on the market: Banjo-Kazooie and Super Mario 64.
You wanna tell us there were better platformers at the time?
What??? Gex? Crash Bandicoot? erm... Tomb Raider 1??
Go put them head to head.
No way, my friend.

And another thing: I'm pretty sure BK-N&B is the best platformer on the 360 by far.
You seem you don't like a good 3D-platformer at all.

[theUndead_feature]

Ok, I like Banjo Kazooie, let's be clear on that...

but I'll take Gex 64 over that any day.

[Kanti 3000]

Originally Posted by theUndead_feature

Ok, I like Banjo Kazooie, let's be clear on that...

but I'll take Gex 64 over that any day.

Gex is so underappreciated! Although I can't say I'm a huge fan of any of the 64 era platformers.

[theUndead_feature]

Originally Posted by Kanti 3000

Gex is so underappreciated! Although I can't say I'm a huge fan of any of the 64 era platformers.

Yeah, I hear ya. I had more fun with decidedly non-platformer 64 games. Super Mario 64 was enjoyable, very, but it doesn't hold a candle to Super Smash Bros.!

[Mickeymac]

Originally Posted by SKTTR

How come?

You said two decades ago, when people were still playing on the NES.

Originally Posted by SKTTR

In June 1998, when BK was released, there were only two great 3D-Jump&Run's on the market: Banjo-Kazooie and Super Mario 64.

That is only an opinion, not a fact.

Originally Posted by SKTTR

You wanna tell us there were better platformers at the time?

The aformentioned Super Mario 64, Kirby 64, Chameleon Twist, and Donkey Kong 64. Or I'd simply go back to my Sega Genesis and play Sonic or Vectorman. Not to mention the fact that I never limited myself to a single genre, as I often spent more time with Star Fox 64, Super Smash Bros, or Mega Man 64 than anything else.

Originally Posted by SKTTR

What??? Gex? Crash Bandicoot? erm... Tomb Raider 1??
Go put them head to head.
No way, my friend.

I have never played those games, nor do I ever intend to.

Originally Posted by SKTTR

And another thing: I'm pretty sure BK-N&B is the best platformer on the 360 by far.

Wrong, that would be Braid.

Originally Posted by SKTTR

You seem you don't like a good 3D-platformer at all.

That is a very incorrect statement. The platforming genre is one of my favorites, with many on my list of greatest games of all time. I just don't like the Banjo series. In fact, I'm rather insulted by your comment, since you're essentially saying that all of my favorite games suck.

[digiki]

Originally Posted by Mickeymac

Or I'd simply go back to my Sega Genesis and play Sonic or Vectorman.

You take that back!

[SKTTR]

Originally Posted by mickeymac

you said two decades ago, when people were still playing on the nes.

i meant 12 years ago.

that is only an opinion, not a fact.

i'm not talking about your personal opinion,
i'm talking all general facts. (reviews & sales)

the aformentioned super mario 64, kirby 64, chameleon twist, and donkey kong 64. Or i'd simply go back to my sega genesis and play sonic or vectorman. Not to mention the fact that i never limited myself to a single genre, as i often spent more time with star fox 64, super smash bros, or mega man 64 than anything else.

there was no kirby 64, no dk64 at the time,
and chameleon twist is a little 1-hour-platformer with 6 short levels.
No one said you limited yourself ar whatever.
But seeing you put megadrive sonic and vectorman against super mario 64 and banjo-kazooie is funny.

that is a very incorrect statement. The platforming genre is one of my favorites, with many on my list of greatest games of all time. I just don't like the banjo series. In fact, i'm rather insulted by your comment, since you're essentially saying that all of my favorite games suck.

come on. You know i didn't say that.
At least i love starfox 64 and smash bros just like you do.
And i have chameleon twist 1&2 in my collection.

[Tull]

Im no fan of the collect-a-thon timesink(in fact i hate it wery much, thank you Rare) in platformers, thanks again Rare :P

[Angelic Lapras King]

The aformentioned Super Mario 64, Kirby 64,

Kirby 64 was more 2.5D then 3D...

[Mickeymac]

Originally Posted by Angelic Lapras King

Kirby 64 was more 2.5D then 3D...

He never specified 3D, he just said platformers.

And SKTTR, since you got me all confused now, how's about we just agree to disagree and call it a day, eh?

You know, to be perfectly honest, I think the real thing that killed Banjo-Kazooie for me was hype. I honestly expected it to knock my socks off, and it never did, and I resent it for it.

So congratulations, now Banjo-Kazooie gets to sit right alongside Super Mario Bros. 3, Secret of Mana, and Street Fighter 3 in the catagory of Games I Would've Enjoyed If Everyone Had Just Shut Up about It.

[Kanti 3000]

Originally Posted by Mickeymac

He never specified 3D, he just said platformers.

And SKTTR, since you got me all confused now, how's about we just agree to disagree and call it a day, eh?

You know, to be perfectly honest, I think the real thing that killed Banjo-Kazooie for me was hype. I honestly expected it to knock my socks off, and it never did, and I resent it for it.

So congratulations, now Banjo-Kazooie gets to sit right alongside Super Mario Bros. 3, Secret of Mana, and Street Fighter 3 in the catagory of Games I Would've Enjoyed If Everyone Had Just Shut Up about It.

Or in the case of SMB3, you might have enjoyed it more if you had bothered to play more than one level.

[hansolo350]

Originally Posted by Mickeymac

He never specified 3D, he just said platformers.

And SKTTR, since you got me all confused now, how's about we just agree to disagree and call it a day, eh?

You know, to be perfectly honest, I think the real thing that killed Banjo-Kazooie for me was hype. I honestly expected it to knock my socks off, and it never did, and I resent it for it.

So congratulations, now Banjo-Kazooie gets to sit right alongside Super Mario Bros. 3, Secret of Mana, and Street Fighter 3 in the catagory of Games I Would've Enjoyed If Everyone Had Just Shut Up about It.

Actually he did say 3D platformers.

[Mickeymac]

Originally Posted by Kanti 3000

Or in the case of SMB3, you might have enjoyed it more if you had bothered to play more than one level.

Don't start this again G-ddamn it! I already told you, I don't play **** I don't like!

[Kanti 3000]

Originally Posted by Mickeymac

Don't start this again G-ddamn it! I already told you, I don't play **** I don't like!

Hey man, I just don't understand how you can judge a game based on one level.

Back on topic though, your points on Banjo Kazooie are totally valid. Like it or not, Banjo Kazooie is a total collectathon.

Edit: sorry, first world of SMB3, not level.

[Jogurt the Yogurt]

Originally Posted by Kanti 3000

Hey man, I just don't understand how you can judge a game based on one level.

If Mick's going to get upset about it, I guess it's time we realize that all of our gaming habits are vastly different. Gaming fills different needs within each of our lives. While we may criticize Mick for the way he decides what he plays/likes, Mick is also justified in criticizing me/Kanti/enig/etc. for buying games and then not playing them. The fact is that we all need/want/expect different things from our gaming experiences.

It's a shame that expectations can ruin a game so drastically for someone, though. I tend to be able to enjoy a game on its own merits, dissociating it from what I've heard about it or what other people think about it. Ditto with movies. I'm able to enjoy movies like Lord of the Rings or Dark Knight as movies (which is what they are), without letting my opinions of other related but distinct media impair my judgment. Some people aren't able to do this.

[Mickeymac]

Originally Posted by Jogurt the Yogurt

It's a shame that expectations can ruin a game so drastically for someone, though. I tend to be able to enjoy a game on its own merits, dissociating it from what I've heard about it or what other people think about it.

Yeah, I try to do that most of the time, but I forgot to do that Banjo Kazooie, although now that I think about it, really should've. It's a collect-a-thon, so I should've known that I wouldn't be that fond of the gameplay, and I think it's become plainly obvious that Rare's ideas of charm differs vastly from mine. Really, I feel kind of stupid for expecting it to be "the next big thing".

[Mr. Cheez]

Originally Posted by SKTTR

How come?

In June 1998, when BK was released, there were only two great 3D-Jump&Run's on the market: Banjo-Kazooie and Super Mario 64.
You wanna tell us there were better platformers at the time?
What??? Gex? Crash Bandicoot? erm... Tomb Raider 1??

I've never played the N64 Banjos, but I'd probably prefer Warped! over a momotonous collect-a-thon any day...

Call me crazy, but this is actually one of my favorite 360 games right now. The vehicle building is fun and leaves a lot of room for creativity, the missions are actually quite entertaining, and it's got a great sense of humor. Those 8 months I've reserved it for really paid off! XD

All 360 owners owe it to themselves to give it a shot.

[Mickeymac]

Originally Posted by Mr. Cheez

I've never played the N64 Banjos, but I'd probably prefer Warped! over a momotonous collect-a-thon any day...

Call me crazy, but this is actually one of my favorite 360 games right now. The vehicle building is fun and leaves a lot of room for creativity, the missions are actually quite entertaining, and it's got a great sense of humor. Those 8 months I've reserved it for really paid off! XD

All 360 owners owe it to themselves to give it a shot.

That...that whole conversation just got way outta hand.:P The truth is, some people just don't like collect-a-thons, myself and Mr. Cheez included.

As for Nuts & Bolts, I've given it about as many chances as I can give it, and I still don't like it. The collect-a-thon Banjo-Kazooie elements are still as annoying as ever, and the "Nuts & Bolts" aspect just feels...unrefined. If they tossed out the platforming, and refined the N&B aspects, I might actually enjoy it a great deal, but as it stands...

[RetroNL]

I like the game very much (BK 64) and to be honest I miss the good collect a ton games. I still cant understand why people dislike this game so much, it is in my opinion one of the best platformers ever made.

As for the N64 I would even choose this as the best game (yeah even better than Zelda OOT). If only this game will be released on VC one day . .
For me this game is a solid 10/10.

[Mickeymac]

Originally Posted by RetroNL

I still cant understand why people dislike this game so much...

Because not everyone wants to spend hours looking for the obsurdly-named item that they need in order to beat the game(or even just to get to the next level). Not to mention some people don't like the childishness of the story and characters, and I personally didn't care for the level design - I prefer it when a level has an actual end.

Really, it's all down to tastes.

And to speak for myself, as much as I like collecting stuff in games, I generally prefer it when they're treated as an extra challenge to extend gameplay. It's just not as fun when collecting them is the entire point of the game - dessert is no longer dessert if it's the main course.

[hansolo350]

Am I the only one that caught all of the innuendo in these games?

[RetroNL]

Originally Posted by Mickeymac

.And to speak for myself, as much as I like collecting stuff in games, I generally prefer it when they're treated as an extra challenge to extend gameplay. It's just not as fun when collecting them is the entire point of the game - dessert is no longer dessert if it's the main course.

Not entirely true, because you need to learn new moves to get to 'newer hights' in the game like the stepstones for jumping and flying for instance, but also some natural moves. Although I agree about the taste.