What Neo Geo games do YOU want to see?

[digiki]

Originally Posted by muesli

(and lets face it, anything that isn't Street Fighter, Mortal Kombat or Smash Bros can be considered "hardcore" these days)

I had to read that a few times since I thought you were saying those games were hardcore...

Anyways I want Garou, Blazing Star, KoF 98, Bust-A-Move (or was it still called Puzzle Bobble?), and Shock Troopers (although I have it on the Wii compilation it should come out since it was lotsa fun). The Last Blade's would be cool too.

[Mickeymac]

Nightmare in the Dark - Sounds like an awesome game!

[stardust]

Originally Posted by Jogurt the Yogurt

Pfft, it's also one of the most hardcore game consoles ever. A lot of hardcore gamers I know have a PS2.

The PS2 was the only successful console of its generation. Hardcore, casual, it didn't matter. If you were a console gamer, you were playing a PS2.

Actually, since for a long time (well, at least in the beginning), Sony and Microsoft were selling consoles for less than what it cost to produce them (just another example of big corporations throwing money around), Nintendo actually gained a lot more net profit off of console sales than either Microsoft or Sony ever did, despite the fact that the two evil giants may have shipped out more consoles.

Even now, as always, the evil giants are still losing money one every console they sell, and while Nintendo is making money by the bookoos, Sony and Microsoft are still trying to show off their mighty power by funneling money into that black hole that formerly represented the Lion's share of the video game market.

And isn't the primary objective of any business to make money, not to lose it??? I wouldn't be surprised to find that one of these two evil giants may as well just withdraw from the consoles market by the end of this generation, especially with the state of the economy.

[Jogurt the Yogurt]

What you say is true, stardust, but it doesn't have a whole lot to do with my point... At this point, Sony is in the green on PS2 sales. More people owned and played PS2 than GCN, DC, and XBox combined multiple times over. People are still buying and playing PS2 in respectable numbers (for an "obsolete" system). And the library is immense.

My point is that calling it a "casual" system just because most of the casual gamers of that generation played it is simply ridiculous in all bold letters. Most of the every-kind-of-gamers played PS2!

[Refa]

Originally Posted by Jogurt the Yogurt

What you say is true, stardust, but it doesn't have a whole lot to do with my point... At this point, Sony is in the green on PS2 sales. More people owned and played PS2 than GCN, DC, and XBox combined multiple times over. People are still buying and playing PS2 in respectable numbers (for an "obsolete" system). And the library is immense.

My point is that calling it a "casual" system just because most of the casual gamers of that generation played it is simply ridiculous in all bold letters. Most of the every-kind-of-gamers played PS2!

I guess you're right that calling it casual is wrong, but is calling it hardcore right?

BTW, I just got ICO for 20$. That was a good deal!

[Jogurt the Yogurt]

Originally Posted by Refa

I guess you're right that calling it casual is wrong, but is calling it hardcore right?

No. That's exactly my point. Teh End.

BTW, congrats on picking up Ico. I've been looking everywhere for a cheap copy.

So, how 'bout that local Neo Geo team?

[Mickeymac]

If we ever get Neo Geo CD games, I hope they eventually bring us Last Hope, since it is far too expensive to warrent a purchase these days, and I heard it wasn't great, but for $10 it would be worth it.

Edit: Probably not, or at least, not for a long while. I just realized that Last Hope was made in 2005, and it's still available on the market via mail-order from the developer's site. Oh well, so much for that.

[pdRydia]

I have little to no knowledge of the Neo Geo library, and haven't really looked into it much, either on the VC or in compilations. The games I've seen from it lean heavily toward genres that don't interest me (fighters, shooters, sports...)

I'd love to see some more platformers, though, as the VC is a bit lacking in the non-Nintendo platformers department. I'd also like to see what kind of puzzle games existed on the NG.

[Mickeymac]

Originally Posted by pdRydia

I have little to no knowledge of the Neo Geo library, and haven't really looked into it much, either on the VC or in compilations. The games I've seen from it lean heavily toward genres that don't interest me (fighters, shooters, sports...)

I'd love to see some more platformers, though, as the VC is a bit lacking in the non-Nintendo platformers department. I'd also like to see what kind of puzzle games existed on the NG.

Well, the only good platformer that I know of is Nightmare in the Dark, so you might want to try that. The only puzzle game that I know of off the top of my head is Bust-a-Move, although I'm pretty sure there's more.

[Marky Vigoroth]

I really want Puzzle Bubble/Bust-a-Move.

[Refa]

Originally Posted by Jogurt the Yogurt

BTW, congrats on picking up Ico. I've been looking everywhere for a cheap copy.

Thanks. Unfortunately, my PS2 recently broke down, so I'm going to have to borrow a friend's (PS2).

[Betagam7]

I just want to see the collection released on dics. Not buying anymore of the VC games after I realised there 50hz borderfests.

[slangman]

Dunno those are the only ones I can think of:

King of Fighters 95
King of Fighters 96
King of Fighters 97
King of Fighters 98
King of Fighters 99
King of Fighters 00
Garou: Mark of The Wolves
Last Blade 1 & 2
Waku Waku 7
Pulstar
SNK vs. Capcom: SVC Chaos
Shock Troopers 2nd Squad

I may as well just grab them from a collection when they come out. Sounds like a waste of time downloading the VC versions unless the emulation isn't as good.

[Betagam7]

Originally Posted by slangman

Dunno those are the only ones I can think of:

King of Fighters 95
King of Fighters 96
King of Fighters 97
King of Fighters 98
King of Fighters 99
King of Fighters 00
Garou: Mark of The Wolves
Last Blade 1 & 2
Waku Waku 7
Pulstar
SNK vs. Capcom: SVC Chaos
Shock Troopers 2nd Squad

I may as well just grab them from a collection when they come out. Sounds like a waste of time downloading the VC versions unless the emulation isn't as good.

It couldn't be any worse than the VC versions. I only picked up Magician Lord. Borders and slower gameplay. I hear that like the Mega Drive, the NEO GEO VC is crippled. Wait for the collection to hit the UK (if its coming) I bet it has the 60hz versions.

[Refa]

Originally Posted by slangman

Dunno those are the only ones I can think of:

King of Fighters 95
King of Fighters 96
King of Fighters 97
King of Fighters 98
King of Fighters 99
King of Fighters 00
Garou: Mark of The Wolves
Last Blade 1 & 2
Waku Waku 7
Pulstar
SNK vs. Capcom: SVC Chaos
Shock Troopers 2nd Squad

I may as well just grab them from a collection when they come out. Sounds like a waste of time downloading the VC versions unless the emulation isn't as good.

All of the SNK VS Capcom games were horrible, though...

They were WAAY worse than SNK fighters, which doesn't make ANY sense in retrospective.

[marktheshark]

Originally Posted by Refa

All of the SNK VS Capcom games were horrible, though...

They were WAAY worse than SNK fighters, which doesn't make ANY sense in retrospective.

Even SVC: Match of the Milennium and SVC Card Fighters Clash? I also don't see how SVC chaos is so bad.

[Mickeymac]

Originally Posted by marktheshark

Even SVC: Match of the Milennium and SVC Card Fighters Clash? I also don't see how SVC chaos is so bad.

Yeah, I know. Yes, SVC Chaos is probably one of the worst entries in the VS. series, but it's still a fun game, and it's certainly a lot deeper than most of them. It's actually my most played entry in the series, and not just because it has Zero in it!

And Match of the Millenium is honestly the best in the series, IMO. It's the only one to include Felicia, and it also has a tag mode and a team mode, multiple -Ism's, unlockable characters, personalized win-quotes, and remarkably deep gameplay, especially since it was on a portable system with only 2 buttons. I don't think I could possibly ask for more...except Hsien Ho.

[Refa]

Originally Posted by Mickeymac

Yeah, I know. Yes, SVC Chaos is probably one of the worst entries in the VS. series, but it's still a fun game, and it's certainly a lot deeper than most of them. It's actually my most played entry in the series, and not just because it has Zero in it!

And Match of the Millenium is honestly the best in the series, IMO. It's the only one to include Felicia, and it also has a tag mode and a team mode, multiple -Ism's, unlockable characters, personalized win-quotes, and remarkably deep gameplay, especially since it was on a portable system with only 2 buttons. I don't think I could possibly ask for more...except Hsien Ho.

I'm very sad (seriously) to say that you misunderstand me. I didn't say all Capcom title VS SNK titles sucked (or at least that was NOT my intention). I just mesnt SVC Chaos and the DS one. I love the Neo Geo Pocket ones (even if my only expirience with them is through an emulator). I should rephrase it to as far as the VC is concerned, the series is hopeless. BTW, I'll probably get this anyways because it has ZERO in it... BAD-ASS!

[Mickeymac]

Originally Posted by Refa

I'm very sad (seriously) to say that you misunderstand me. I didn't say all Capcom title VS SNK titles sucked (or at least that was NOT my intention). I just mesnt SVC Chaos and the DS one.

No, this is what you said:

Originally Posted by Refa

All of the SNK VS Capcom games were horrible, though...

They were WAAY worse than SNK fighters, which doesn't make ANY sense in retrospective.

The Neo Geo Pocket games were Labeled SNK vs. Capcom.

...but I guess you figured that out. Anyways, even if SVC Chaos doesn't come to the VC, at least there's an Xbox version that we can all enjoy!(only SNK game that works on a 360)

[Relavant Latrommi]

I doubt it's possible to put the 600+ Megs games up on the VC. Would be nice to see Twikle Sprites up (though I'm not into shooters or fighters in general).

How about Super Spy? I hear it's good but I have no idea how it plays...

[Refa]

Originally Posted by Relavant Latrommi

I doubt it's possible to put the 600+ Megs games up on the VC. Would be nice to see Twikle Sprites up (though I'm not into shooters or fighters in general).

How about Super Spy? I hear it's good but I have no idea how it plays...

Many people say this is possible by compression, but I really don't understand HOW that would work out.

[Mickeymac]

Originally Posted by Refa

Many people say this is possible by compression, but I really don't understand HOW that would work out.

By compressing it. 330 megs is only about 40 megabytes(MB). That can easily be compressed to about 1/2 to 1/3 that size, as in 20-14 MB. Unfortunately, I don't know how big a block is, but I do know that the Wii's internal memory can store 512 MB, so at the very least the Neo Geo games won't take up that much space.

[Refa]

Originally Posted by Mickeymac

By compressing it. 330 megs is only about 40 megabytes(MB). That can easily be compressed to about 1/2 to 1/3 that size, as in 20-14 MB. Unfortunately, I don't know how big a block is, but I do know that the Wii's internal memory can store 512 MB, so at the very least the Neo Geo games won't take up that much space.

So there are no downsides? Seems kinda... wierd that there wouldn't be any.

[Mickeymac]

Originally Posted by Refa

So there are no downsides? Seems kinda... wierd that there wouldn't be any.

Hey, when you got a size limit as big as 40 MB(which was a lot back in 1991), you're gonna try your hardest to fill it up.

[stardust]

Originally Posted by Mickeymac

Unfortunately, I don't know how big a block is, but I do know that the Wii's internal memory can store 512 MB, so at the very least the Neo Geo games won't take up that much space.

1 block Wii memory = 1/8 Mb, or 128kb, or 131072 bytes, or 1048576 bits.
BTW, a kilobyte is 1024 bytes, not 1000

As for the question "What NeoGeo Games do you want to see?" is a good question; I would like to see more of anything that's not in the firghter/sports catagorey...

[Mickeymac]

Originally Posted by stardust

1 block Wii memory = 1/8 Mb, or 128kb, or 131072 bytes, or 1048576 bits.

Thank you! So uncompressed, the larger Neo Geo games should take up a little over 300 blocks, and a lot less if they compress it.

Originally Posted by stardust

BTW, a kilobyte is 1024 bytes, not 1000.

Close enough for government work.

[LinkFanatic]

I only saw 2 games that interested me back then...one was Gex, the other was some game show...can't remember what it's called

[Mickeymac]

Originally Posted by LinkFanatic

I only saw 2 games that interested me back then...one was Gex, the other was some game show...can't remember what it's called

...you're kidding, right?

Oh wait, that game wasn't even on the Neo Geo. You're thinking of the 3DO.

[slangman]

Originally Posted by Mickeymac

Thank you! So uncompressed, the larger Neo Geo games should take up a little over 300 blocks, and a lot less if they compress it.

I think Metal Slug 2 is compressed anyway. Although the Neo Geo AES version takes up almost 400 Megabits. It might be possible for games like Garou: Mark of the Wolves

[Relavant Latrommi]

Are any Neo Geo/N64 games compressed? If so then imagine the larger, later games getting compressed! :O

I saw one game at 804 Megs which is about 100MBs but that was a very,very late Neo Geo game.

[Refa]

Originally Posted by Relavant Latrommi

Are any Neo Geo/N64 games compressed? If so then imagine the larger, later games getting compressed! :O

I saw one game at 804 Megs which is about 100MBs but that was a very,very late Neo Geo game.

I don't think N64 games are compressed, but I dunno about Neo-Geo games.

[Relavant Latrommi]

I doubt that most N64 games need to be compressed since the largest game on the N64 took up 64MB (which I think was Resident Evil 2). So maybe the largest N64 games need to be compressed but the latter half of the Neo Geo library need to be compressed in order for those to get on the Wii.

Which is a shame really since alot of Neo Geo lovers here would love to play the latter (if not better) games of the lifespan.

[Refa]

Originally Posted by Relavant Latrommi

Which is a shame really since alot of Neo Geo lovers here would love to play the latter (if not better) games of the lifespan.

I'm not a Neo-Geo lover, but I'd looooooooooooooooooooooooove to see some Mark Of The Wolves, Last Blades, and the later KoF games on the vc myself.

[stardust]

Originally Posted by Relavant Latrommi

Are any Neo Geo/N64 games compressed? If so then imagine the larger, later games getting compressed! :O

The original ROM size of Paper Mario was 40 Mbytes (320Mbits) - that would be equivalent to 320 Wii blocks uncompressed, which ironically enough is what the shop channel requires you to have open on your system to download. That would be 320 blocks not including the emulator and game manual that is included with every VC game. The compressed ROM size is 249 Blocks, or 249Mbits, or 31.25 Mbytes. So yes, Paper Mario is compressed.

On the other hand, Super Mario 64 is 8 Mbytes (64 Mbits), yet the VC download is 90 Wii blocks/ Mbits, or 11.25 Mbytes, so we can assume that it is not compressed, and the system emulator/ game manual takes up slightly more than 3.25 Mbytes or 26 blocks. C'mon Nintendo; that is just lazy! Mario 64 was also the first and only N64 game available on Nintendo's service at launch, so this may have been before Nintendo started compressing games.

In terms of compression, the actual Mario 64 ROM is 8 Mbytes in file size and compresses down to 5-something Mbytes using WinZip, which is sort of the de-facto standard for data compression. Using WinRAR, the file size is reduced to just a little bit less than 5 Mbytes, or 4-something. Many NES and SNES games, since most old systems did not implement data compression due to low CPU resources, generally compress down roughly to between a third and a half of their original file size.

Seeing that Nintendo has the source code for all of its games, they may be able to optimize the compression algorythm for NeoGeo and N64 games to provide better compression rates for game data as opposed to generic compression schemes that are suitable for all file types. As for the Turbo-CD games, their actual game code was in many instances relatively small, so Nintendo have merely compressed the CD-audio using some type of lossy audio encoding, most likely ACC or some similar format. A lot of indie developers use Vorbis audio to encode their Wiiware games. Given the very limited nature of VC/ Wiiware storage (until Nintendo gets off their lazy rump and does something about the storage problem), I believe Nintendo should make it mandatory that all developers make efforts to compress their game code. The huge glut of 300+ block games out there on Wiiware tells us that many developers only care enough to compress the game to within the 40 Megabyte/ 320 block limit, and little or no moreso than that. It wouldn't surprize me if many of the simpler 200-something block games were not compressed at all.